071314EnzoMari

 -- tactlessAnalyst [TA] began pestering anaximandersTrepidation [AT] at 18:57 --

 [06:57] AT: ∴ Oh, Good evening to you. ∴

 [06:58] TA: Good evening. Or good morning, rather, since that is the time at my location. How fared your day?

 [06:59] AT: ∴ Ah ha, well we do live on a large binary planet, however I have to say, I survived my day, ∴

 [06:59] AT: ∴ Without help from anything but my mind. ∴

 [07:00] TA: Would you expect to find help anywhere else?

 [07:00] AT: ∴ Of course not, I merely take pride in the fact there can be on true answers aside from what I observe; ∴

 [07:01] AT: ∴ i.e. I have no need of magic or fancy tricks ∴

 [07:01] TA: Magic is nonsense of course, but your belief in some truth beyond the observed is nearly as absurd.

 [07:02] AT: ∴ Ah, this is were we disagree, Mister/Miss... ∴

 [07:03] TA: Still not telling. Not that it should matter.

 [07:03] AT: ∴ understandable, I will with hold my gender and name as well. ∴

 [07:03] TA: As is your right, of course.

 [07:04] AT: ∴ However, I am interested in your views on faith in what you cannot observe. ∴

 [07:05] TA: Simple. That which is unobservable, does not exist.

 [07:07] AT: ∴ agreed, therefore, Truth must exist in a real, tangible way, beyond the "explination" science gives ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:07] AT: ∴ Explination not equal to answers for my purposes ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:08] TA: Your search for truth is a sad, futile quest. There is no such thing in the universe beyond what we impose.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:10] AT: ∴ My dear, TA, I simply disagree ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:10] AT: ∴ There are answers to be gained from the human and troll minds, even the stars and what lies beyond. ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:12] TA: No answers worth gaining. Just a mess of delusions and biases.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:13] AT: ∴ bias, perhaps, delusion only in the grasp for the irrational, but truth and understanding can be gained, ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:13] AT: ∴ The universe has too much order to not be able to draw meaning from chaos ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:14] TA: Any meaning you draw is self-imposed. It is not inherent to the structure of reality.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:14] TA: The universe simply is.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:14] TA: Anyone who says differently is selling something.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:16] AT: ∴ I don't intent to sell anything, but I do differ in opinion; ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:17] AT: ∴ I feel truth can be gained through a logical understanding of reality, however reality may present itself. ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:17] TA: And I doubt I shall ever convince you otherwise.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:18] AT: ∴ Nor do I feel I could convince you to seek truth, ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:18] AT: ∴ nor will I. ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:19] TA: Enough navel-gazing! Always, you mangage to draw me into these ridiculous discussions.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:20] AT: ∴ Hah! If we do not take inventory of ourselves, how can we build great rockets or cure diseases? ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:20] AT: ∴ We can blindly "do science" but isn't that how mad scientists are born? ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:21] TA: Indeed it is. And mad scientists change the world in ways philosophers never could.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:22] AT: ∴ hmmm, so you maintain Descartes never changed the world? ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:22] AT: ∴ Plato? Troll Neitzsche? ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:23] TA: Of course not. Plato and Desartes' influences on mathematics were extraordinary.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:25] TA: Just because they wasted their time in philosophy does not invalidate their productive work.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:26] AT: ∴ Their time spent gaining insight and understanding of our world through the power of logic and reason helped them understand math on a deeper level. ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:26] AT: ∴ I maintain, anyway. ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:27] TA: Maintain baselessly, I say, but you will not be swayed.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:28] AT: ∴ What you say is true, both in my assumption and that I plan on remaining unswayable. ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:28] TA: At the moment, I lack the energy to try, anyways. I've just realized I've worked through the night again.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:29] AT: ∴ Ah, another restless brilliant mind, eh? ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:29] AT: ∴ Any particular project keeping you up, or just my ramblings? ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:30] TA: I think I might have solved the stabilization problem for my new flightboard. I still need to run a few tests, but I'm not cetain I'm awake enough to do so.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:31] AT: ∴ Fascinating. Why would one need a flightboard? ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:31] TA: To fly, of course.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:32] AT: ∴ Could one not fly using more traditional, not to mention safer, forms of travel? ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:33] TA: I have tried. They do not work to my satisfaction.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:34] TA: They have all failed in mid-air.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:35] AT: ∴ Ah, and you only fly by your own methods, not in vehicles made by others? ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:36] TA: I will not be reliant on others to achieve something as important as flight.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:37] AT: ∴ Hmmm, yet others invented flying machines, have they not? ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:38] TA: That they did. So I should be able to as well.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:38] AT: ∴ Understandable, and yours should be the best, eh? ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:39] AT: ∴ Hmmm, the Sun is coming up over the trees, my father will check to see if I'm asleep soon. ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:39] TA: And I must be getting to bed as well.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:40] TA: Good night or good morning, AT.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:40] AT: ∴ And good night/ good morning to you, TA. I enjoyed our discourse and hope to indulge in it again ∴

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;-qt-block-indent:0;text-indent:0px;"> [07:41] TA: I suppose you will drag me back into it eventually. But until then.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;"> -- anaximandersTrepidation [AT] ceased pestering tactlessAnalyst [TA] at 19:42 --